The Painful Truth About The Worldwide Church of God
 

Conversations with Bill and Jim

(Some email chatter between Bill Fairchild, Jim V, and myself that we decided to share)

[For best results, start at the bottom and read UP...] 

 

[Bill]

Wednesday, June 23, 2004 10:50 AM

 

I can agree with most of what Jim says here.  I think there are many more of us today who are seriously aware of how bad we are as a species than Jim thinks.  I am continually amazed at how many journalists are writing thoughtful, critically thought out, decent articles on all the dozens of various alternative news media websites I read now all the effing time.  And I only look at a couple of dozen.  Every once in a while I see a website with a list of all known websites with similar stuff, and there are hundreds of them.  Still those of us who can think rationally and humbly admit publicly of our own terrible shortcomings are in a tiny minority compared to all people.  But 0.0001% of 7 billion people is still a pretty sizable number, and I just pulled the 0.0001% number out of my ass.  It’s probably a much higher percentage of us who are real human beings instead of merely bipeds.

 

 

[Jimv]

Wednesday, June 23, 2004 10:50 AM

 Mike,

Bill already knows what I am going to say....

As a species, we are still too much predator. We still have one foot firmly placed in the caves from where we arose. And our veneer of civilization is very, very thin -- sometimes invisible. Sometimes nonexistent.

There is no holy spirit, no conversion, no changing of our nature to a "higher level" of existence. We have at least 3 million years of predatory bloodlust flowing through our veins and sadly -- through our minds. And every one of those years was an existence as both predator and as prey. Fight or die. Kill or be killed.

We have computers -- and we use fingers and hands that are still just as adapt at griping spears, knives and arrows as a keyboard. We are animals with human intellect, and we are predators who wear 3 piece suits. As a species -- we don't care "why" we kill -- we just kill.   

Psychopathic killers are not some strange aberration of our species -- it is locked in our nature as a species to kill. The psychopaths simply revert back just a little bit further than most of us. (Some of our kind still have "both" feet in the cave.) Those who prey on the weak, the unaware, or the believers are not "strange," they are simply "modern" predators fulfilling the bloodlust accumulated over 3 million years of human development.

Hitler was no aberration of our species. There are millions of "Hitler's" alive and well right now, today, at this very moment. All they lack is power. Power does not corrupt, it merely brings out what was really there all along. Is is a very, very good thing that many millions of our species are limited to power only over their familes, because if very many of our species had "real" power -- we would see just how many "Hitler's" there really are.

The only aberration about Hitler was the extreme rarity for one individual to possess such great power. Most madmen are limited and restrained.

We are not yet civilizied beings, and we have a very long way to go. We are still very much predators and animals, as a species.

But I think the very fact that the 3 of us, and others, are not preying on the sheep (and we know how), gives hope for us as a species. Today we are extremely rare and we are in a vast minority. But maybe the day will come when those like us are the norm and will rule...

That is the day when we will be truly civilized as a species.

Jim

 

[Bill]

Wednesday, June 23, 2004 10:44 AM

 Our PT site is designed to be anti-WWCG primarily, then, in decreasing priority (this is my own estimation) and as the number of people involved with each problem grows larger, (2) anti- all religion, (3) anti- all myths, (4) anti- all deluded thinking.  Politics enters in the previous priority sequence at least at the 3rd level, as politics involves mass hypnosis, mass propaganda, mass mind manipulation, and is definitely based on deluded thinking, just as all religions are.  Politics has been identical with religion in much of the world’s history in many countries.  Right now our nation is being “led” by a “leader” who is a religious nut case.  So right now in the USA politics=religion.

 Meanwhile, I have a new big one for you that I will send in about an hour that ties religion and politics together.  I have received some critical acclaim already for this piece.  It is T.F. AWESOME (my own humble opinion).

 Bill

  

[Editor]

Tuesday, June 22, 2004 7:14 PM

 Sure. Fear is the motivator. And a great one at that.

 One thought comes to mind:

 "Channing knew well enough that his prosperous Boston contemporaries were fearful of the political power of "the labouring classes," and he also knew that their fear was justified in so far as the masses could be used as tools. He insisted nevertheless that it was the vices of the prosperous which bring about a community's downfall, and he denounced those who used the French Revolution as a horrible example of what happens when the mob has power' The saddest aspect of the age, he said in 1840, "is that which undoubtedly contributes to social order. . . . It is the selfish prudence which is never tired of the labour of accumulation, and which keeps men steady, regular, respectable drudges from morning to night." (Boldface is mine)

  William Ellery Channing in 1830 http://xroads.virginia.edu/~HYPER/Made/ch06.html

 The PT site is not political, nor should it be, with our eye to the specific window on the Priests and Their Conmen. But politics DOES constitute a great part of this entire equation of life, in my opinion. Free Thinking and independence is the mantra here; and so I have to say that in all honesty, what Bush is doing here is not new. Nothing here is new, in this current history we are watching.

 But my question remains, and is re-worded: Is this the dawn of a new era, where America is governed by a Priest? Have we thrown off the cloak of WCG only to subscribe to a new theocracy?

 Also, again... What has happened since FDR (in your opinion) that has made such a ground-shaking change to our nation, to Independents, both politically and religious?

 Apologize if this is sounding like an interview, but that's me and you... And it is in a way. ..<grin>

 I listened to a South Korean human being beg for his life last night on my television while I ate a turkey pot pie..

 He is dead today.

 What the frick is WRONG with us, as a species?

 You have the floor Bill and Jim...

 

 

[Bill]

Sent: Tuesday, June 22, 2004 11:34 AM

Nothing works quite so well as fear to get the masses to knuckle under willingly and surrender their power.  And we had a nice big dose of fear on 9-11.

One possible good result from all this global shit going on now is that thanks to Bush we may soon destroy almost all human life and severely irradiate all survivors, perhaps causing major mutations in their offspring.  One resulting mutation may be that human beings no longer have an inner need to believe in irrational myths and blatant lies. 

But they might also all be sterile. 

Bill

 

[Editor] [mailto:Editor@hwarmstrong.com ]

Tuesday, June 22, 2004 11:00 AM

Bill,

Yes, I agree. The Uncivil War, FDR, and then what is the next Big One that changed the face of our government, making it essentially, a Christian State with a Head Priest? The practice of Ruling by Executive Order comes to mind....

 

 

[JimV]

Tuesday, June 22, 2004 11:01 AM

but the principal domestic activity now seems to be swindles.

You mean like all of the corporate take overs, buyouts, warbucks for the billionaires, etc???

 

[Bill F]

Tuesday, June 22, 2004 10:40 AM

Hamilton himself was an educated, rational thinker.  Unfortunately, his thinking was very wrong.  He wanted a strong central government and weak states.  Jefferson was the main intellectual force behind the opposite theory, which was a weak central government and strong states.  Typical of what always goes wrong is the distortion of the meaning of words.  In 1776 the word “federal” meant what Jefferson wanted – powerful states giving a very small percent of their power to a weak central government whose sole purpose was to coordinate affairs between two or more states and between the new nation and other nations.  Today the word “federal” means the all-powerful monster we have in D.C.

The battle was definitely lost in April, 1865 when Lincoln won his war on the Constitutional issue of states’ rights, one of which was the right to secede.  Then the tiny power in D.C. began to grow like the radioactive blob in so many sci-fi horror movies.  The more it eats, the bigger it gets, with no limit to its growth.  But CultThink didn’t really get ingrained in the nation’s mindset until FDR’s brave new deal.  Then the already bloated D.C. became the nanny state.  Today we have a welfare-warfare state, in which almost every citizen receives some financial benefit from the nanny, and the main export of the nation is war.  Internally, there are still many widely diverse industries, but the principal domestic activity now seems to be swindles.

 Bill

 P.S.:  I hope you post some or all of this email traffic

 

 

[ Editor] [mailto:Editor@hwarmstrong.com ]
Tuesday, June 22, 2004 10:22 AM
Good stuff Bill.....

It's hard to get some folks to see that there's almost no dividing line between politics and religion.

"That was one of the big reasons why Jefferson and other Founding Fathers insisted on keeping religion out of the new government they were creating.  They wanted only educated, rational thinkers to run the country."

Absolutely. And it is this battle that I believe was finally lost to the Hamiltonian Federalists in the "Civil" War, where the State has become the Mother Church in most aspects.

CultThink rules.

Always good to hear from you guys...

Mike

 [Bill F]

Tuesday, June 22, 2004 10:13 AM

 Interesting emails.

 I suppose that someone who considers himself highly Christian, yet is able to have the mental and spiritual courage not to go along with obvious frauds, is much better than a highly Christian person who blindly accepts obvious frauds.  Now if we could only help the Tentmaker to look into other frauds that may be a little less obvious…

 The alleged Paul was a tentmaker, according to the N.T.  I read somewhere along the way that his main customer was probably the Roman Army, as there weren’t many other people in 1st century Palestine who would need to buy a tent.  Just an interesting, meaningless point of trivia that proves nothing.

 A slight disagreement with Jim:  I believe that government is the biggest hoax in human history.  Religion has historically been ˝ of government, the other ˝ being politics.  “We are from Headquarters, and we are here to help you” is the classic lie.  Whether Headquarters is Congress, the White House, or the Vatican, the intended result is still the same – coercion, tyranny over the minds of men, plunder, etc.  Historically tyrants found that a very easy way to control the masses was through irrational fear-based religions, especially one like Christianity that tells us to pray for our governmental leaders, our tyrannical rulers (the powers that be) are ORDAINED OF GOD, etc.  Religion has always been and still is a very big part of the power charade.  That was one of the big reasons why Jefferson and other Founding Fathers insisted on keeping religion out of the new government they were creating.  They wanted only educated, rational thinkers to run the country.

 Bill

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Editor at the PT [mailto:Editor@hwarmstrong.com ]
Sent: Monday, June 21, 2004 8:39 PM
To: B__________@aol.com
Subject: response to r-Campbell

 Thanks Jim.....

 There ya go again... using reason and logic against the faithful:)

 Rock on...;)

 

 

----- Original Message -----

From: B________@aol.com

To: editor@hwarmstrong.com

Sent: Monday, June 21, 2004 8:34 PM

Subject: Disregard previous response to r-Campbell

 Editor,

Concerning r-Campbells spiritual vomit...

 Campbell's bible quote has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with the "Law of conservation of mass and energy." The bible quote of II Peter 3:7 is ludicrous and total ignorance. It is meaningless religious dribble, and nothing more. This ridiculous verse does not "prove" one damn thing in the world, except that god is the author of confusion.

 The bible is saturated with ignorance, dribble and babble.

 The bible didn't know that raw cows milk is potentially fatal. The bible proclaimed it as "clean."

 The bible didn't know there are different blood types, it proclaims that "all" men are of "one" blood.

 The bible claims Joshua destroyed Jerico, but the same archeology that Campbell proclaims as "truth" proves that Jerico was destroyed at least 200 years "before" Joshua's time. (Discovery channel documentary.)

 The bible claims Joshua destroyed Ai, but again, Campbell's own archeology "proves" that Ai was destroyed at least 1200 years "before" Joshua. (Discovery channel documentary.)

 I get so goddamn sick and tired of spiritually drunk christians putting their spiritual diarrhea on a plate and proclaiming it as food. (And then proclaim that "we" are the blind ones.)

 The Tentmaker website is HIGHLY Christian and totally refutes, documents and disproves Campbells hero (Ron Wyatt) and spotlights Campbell's frothing-at-the-mouth spiritual drunkenness.

 Even children would know that if "anyone" found bones, chariots, spears, pruninghooks, glass beer bottles, or anything else "in corral" at the bottom of the red sea -- it would make headlines all over the world for years to come.

 Click here: Wyatt Archaeological Research Fraud Documentation

 Tentmaker quote #1

Since the magazine "Dew from Mount Hermon" published the article "A Great Christian Scam" exposing the so-called discoveries of Ron Wyatt as nothing more than a great hoax perpetrated upon the Christian community for money and fame...

 Tentmaker quote #2

Since the information on Ron Wyatt was published by us several years ago, Ron Wyatt has died. However, there are other people who have stepped into the shoes of Ron Wyatt and continue to perpetuate this fraud.

 Tentmaker quote #3

For the latest information on Ron Wyatt's claims, contact Dr. Colin Standish, Hartland Institute, P.O. Box 1, Rapidan, VA. 22733, USA. Phone number for Dr. Colin Standish at Hartland Institute is 540-672-3100. Phone number for Hartland Publications for ordering the book is 1-800-774-3566.

 

Religion is the greatest hoax ever perpetrated in history.

JimV

 

 

 

 

10/26/2006


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