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    Dear Sirs,

    I was member of the WCG for a period of a little over two years, some forty years ago. I was a teenager then, confused and looking for answers. (Maybe someday I'l tell you more about that.) I wasn't in the church long enough to make lasting friendships there. So after I left I made a clean break---never was really curious of what happened to it afterwards. It is only recently that I stumbled, first on the Painful Truth website, then on Mr. McNally's. I was then left absolutely speechless by the scale of what happened to that organization in those thirty-something years, and of which I had never even suspected anything.

    I would describe myself now as an atheist, so I don't do much reading anymore on religious subjects. But last year I read something by two French guys who are not  theologians or clerics at all---they write books and make movies on all sorts of subjects--- who set out to investigate the Jesus character. This excerpt is from one of a series of three books they co-authored on that theme. Thought I might share this with you:

    [Have mercy on my translation from French. English is but a second language to me]


    In the Gospel according to Matthew, Jesus teaches the following: “You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you”. This paradoxical injunction is presented as the very essence of Jesus’s message—its highest, perhaps most sublime expression. But who, except perhaps on the very eve of Judgment Day, can love his neighbor as himself? Who is up to loving their own enemy, or turning the other cheek when they are slapped? This commandment of love is impossible to apply. In no way can it make up the durable ethics of any human society. As a result, Christians are torn asunder between the ideal they profess on one hand, and the inescapable fact that there is no way they can ever live up to it on the other. It so happens that the only means of alleviating the unbearable tension brought on by this situation is by inflicting violence on others. As if to take out on others their own inability to put the desired attitude in application, Christians will persecute, torture and exterminate those who refuse the commandment of love or choose to turn their backs on it. A tragic paradox which Freud was later to summarize in his work Civilization and its Discontents: “When once the Apostle Paul had posited universal love between men as the foundation of his Christian community, extreme intolerance on the part of Christendom towards those who remained outside it became the inevitable consequence.”

    This uniquely Christian radicalism grafted itself onto a form of exclusiveness already present in Jewish monotheism. From then on, as Guy Stroumsa remarked (1), “the believers in the religion of love were to invent forms of violence and religious intolerance heretofore unknown in the ancient world.”


    Gérard MORDILLAT, Jérôme PRIEUR. Jésus contre Jésus. (Paris, Éditions du Seuil, 1999) pp. 367-368


    (1) STROUMSA, Guy G., Savoir et Salut; « Le radicalisme religieux du premier christianisme », in Les Retours aux écritures, fondamentalisme présent et passé (Peeters, 1993)


    Regards (and also: best wishes for the Holidays---whatever it is they now mean to you!)




    Hi Jean,

    So the WCG wasn't what it presented itself as?
    You my friend left before you could encounter personal damage. Good for you. However for others it was quite a different story. It changed their lives for the worse.

    The blessing's of the Armstrong god became curses, and the promises of eternal life were but a hoax. All this abuse was for the feeding of an egotistical sob who used and abused people. Folks who had an innocent but naive mindset about God, lost their innocence and belief in God.

    But lets not stop there. People still in the various churches of god agree that Herbert W. Armstrong molested his daughter and at the same time think he was sent by God to restore "His" word.

    Yep, for last few decades this kind of immorality has been tolerated in the churches of god. The list of perverted church of god child molesters is growing.

    At the Painful Truth we summarize what Armstrongism is within the context of one paragraph.

    "Armstrong was a man utterly without honor, without principles, without a shred of genuine decency or patriotism. He was the ultimate exterminator of religious life for thousands, and the grand compelling creator of a vast army of atheists." 

    As to your atheism, most people go this route after leaving religion. I myself am agnostic. I do not believe in the bible god nor the bible in any way, shape or form. My views are: if a higher power does exist, this power never wrote a book, talked to any person, or shows any sign of caring for
    humanity. No one can prove the existence of GOD/god's nor disprove it entirely.
    This is why I am agnostic. I am content to say I don't know and I don't care.

    You wrote as to the book:

    `This uniquely Christian radicalism grafted itself onto a form of exclusiveness already present in Jewish monotheism. From then on, as Guy Stroumsa remarked (1), “the believers in the religion of love were to invent forms of violence and religious intolerance heretofore unknown in the ancient world.”

    In this modern day, one can live a morally superior life to that of the christian. Atheists and agnostics can find condolence in the words of Confucius:

    "Do not impose on others what you do not wish for yourself."
    Yes, it is the golden rule (500 BC). But know that this rule is also a two way street. The Christian leaves me alone and I leave him to his beliefs without harassment. If the Christians/neoconservatives ever put this into practice there would be no reason to wage foreign wars (modern day crusades) and kill others that disagree with them or their religion. The past is the
    past, and the future still holds out for the potential goodness for all of humanity. All it takes is mutual respect. 

    Jean, if you ever decide to tell your story, please feel free to share with all. We are interested as to how you got involved and why you left "the little cult of horrors."

    And have a great xmas with your family!



    Dear James,

    Thank you for your kind answer. I will tell you, hopefully someday soon, about that period of my life. In the meantime, here is something I stumbled upon just today, and which might interest you:

    All the best,



    Hello James

    It’s been about 10 years since I made the decision to exit WWCoG

    The church was a traumatic and destructive experience.

    However, the exit itself has also been traumatic; once you no longer focus on the church, you now have to deal with reality – the church was a kind of opiate to the real world, ironic that it caused a lot of pain, but deadened us to the realities of the world.

    Was Carl Marx not right when he said that religion is the opiate of the people?

    A blind, ritualistic system that keeps people in check.

    This gets us back to the people, parents, preachers and politicians thing; indoctrination of the herd. Keep people like sheep. Any sheep that strays to eat some “other grass” is immediately black. Any kind of individuality is seen as rebelliousness. People hate people who make waves; all the entrepreneurs of history were initially met with resistance, even death in some cases. Galileo was a heretic because he said that the earth revolved around the sun.

    My journey of the last ten years has been traumatic in itself; dealing with the reality of the world. Dealing with the reality of the impact of my past, ie many years of neglect and abuse – mainly relating to direction in terms of career and finance – what makes the world go round is money – FACT – many disrespect this truth, to their own peril. When “faith” becomes a system of blind belief, leading to a lack of responsibility and a lack of action, a lack of results, and ultimately immense dissatisfaction, you have to wonder.

    Having made the decision to exit world-wide, I was then faced with a task of eradication of the faulty foundation and building a new one. The herd instinct is everywhere. The biggest difference when leaving WorldWide was one of choice, ie my direction is governed by choice, as far as possible.

    Unfortunately the reality of the hard harsh world hit me hard – we were sheltered from the world, to a large extent, deadened to the very real issues that go on every day. I quickly realized that there was more of the same; the past few years I realized that my own family would never change (they had no connection to World-Wide) – my two brothers just go their own way and my parents were pretty much stuck in their own messes – my efforts to keep in contact with my brothers were met with contempt. My one brother never contacts me, and hardly ever returns calls – he is the one who did something with his life and now has a family with two children. For about 15 years we lived in close proximately – he visited me ONCE about 15 years ago. After that I gave up inviting him and his wife, they were never available – they visited me ONCE after that – a few years ago, one of the few times when I was with a distant family member, I mentioned the fact that my brother had only visited me twice in about 13 years, even though he was within half an hour of me, the response was a retort of “but people are busy”

    People are busy???

    My own father called me for the first time when I was 38 years old. In retrospect, he only called me because he was staying at my brother and his wife’s house (the rich one) – for once, they decided to go somewhere without him, and like a lonely little boy he found himself floundering in my brother’s big house – 38 fucking years to receive a call from my father!

    Of course, my mother never went with my father to visit my (rich) brother because they had reached a point in their lives where my mother’s only aim in life was to spite my father as much as possible

    When I was very young, my father once gave me a spiel about how ungrateful children were, and how once they left home they never bothered to even call their parents. YET, he never called me – it was my job to call him, he never made calls, that was my job and my mother’s job. Yet my mother hardly ever called anyway, her excuse was that they didn’t have money – yeah, right.

    In recent years both my mother and father acquired mobile phones, I discovered this only by accident. It’s not as if I ever got a message “by the way, we have cell phones now, these are our numbers -----“

    In years past, I always tried to support my younger brother, he did not ever get officially married, and had numerous problems, but possibly because he did not follow the normal job/family routine he was a little more available. Sometimes, at the end of the year I would drive down to the coast where he stayed (close to my parents) and spend some time with him. In between, I tried to help him in different ways, I once offered to help him with some correspondence courses, which I would pay for, and if he would successfully pass one course, then I would help him with the next. I tore out facsimiles of the details and gave him the information – I followed up a number of times, he never came back to me, nor even thanked me for my offer.

    About three years ago, I went down to the coast, visited my younger brother and parents. I spent much of the time with my younger brother -  as usual, my funds went towards the trip to the coast, money for gas and money for going places, dinner etc – my brother didn’t have any money, and as usual all costs were for my account.

    Shortly after that, I confronted my brother about his lack of interest; you can imagine the situation – after my efforts of a number of years, I had finally had enough of his rudeness and arrogance. We made arrangements to meet, when I went to pick him up he was so drunk out of his skull, he was in no position to go anywhere – this happened a number of times, I confronted him and he showed his true colors; he told me if that was how “I” felt, we should go our own ways.

    My parents, being typical wimps, blamed me!!!

    My mother gave me a spiel about how I was wrong, and she would go and pray to god that I would change my heart!!!

    This, despite the fact that they obviously knew that he was a drunk, and had to get the police on a number of occasions to lock him away!!!

    Shortly after that, my father passed away.

    At the funeral, only one of my father’s two sisters came. I never even got a call from that aunt.

    Of my parent’s family members, I received a total of ONE call, from an uncle – the first call I ever received from him

    Just before my father died, a distant uncle showed me pictures of my father when they were young, how they went boating and canoeing in their younger days – this only because I had made the effort to track him down and made contact after a number of years of effort.

    Since my father’s funeral, take a guess how many people have called me?

    Right, nothing, zilch, zippo!

    Not even the uncle/family member who showed me the old black & white photos.

    Neither my two brothers nor my mother have made any effort to contact me – things just go one as before

    I turned 50 the other day, I received a brief SMS form my (rich) brother “happy birthday” – that’s it. No big deal, I suppose, a-la-armstrong I never followed the birthday thing

    Having turned 50, doing stock I have hardly anything to show for my life; the only people I really knew where the pricks from World-Wide, recent contacts with a few world-widers/x-world-widers only left me with the same sour taste in my mouth.

    After agreeing to help an x-world wider with one of his courses, I received not even a thank you, in fact I received a tongue-lashing and criticism – even though no longer in world-wide, I received a no-holds-barred expose of my character and spiritual destiny! I’m a slow learner; I did not see that coming!

    I recently received a rather odd email from a “hanger-on world-wider”; the heading was something like “friends are forever or until we disagree with them” – the content was very brief and went something like “it would be nice if you could give me a call or a visit sometime”


    This from an idiot who was invited to my place in previous years, and never came – about three years ago I was invited by this idiot to attend World-Wide – I received assurances that everything was different now – I was extremely reluctant to attend even once – however, I was secretly hoping to bump into someone who could make sense of the whole situation, and since I had no contact with anyone, it would be a welcome relief to acknowledge the experience at least – walking around “in the world” with no one understanding your cult-origins is not pleasant.

    I have very little that is positive to report about my experience, at least I saw first-hand what had become of the “old gang” – while outwardly not embracing distorted doctrines, I can see why many in World-Wide just took it up the ass year after year; those left are super lackadaisical and apathetic, and very accepting – still good little sheep.

    Despite all that has happened, there is a reluctance to accept, and even discuss what happened.

    On numerous occasions, I heard the phrase “you can’t blame the church” – yes, you can!

    On one occasion, I was told by one of the members in no uncertain terms “you must repent, you have the doctrine of satan” after making some harmless comment

    But I guess, the most significant thing was the complete lack of response to any suggestion/initiative outside of their norms – after church I had trundled along to my idiot friend’s house a number of times, my openness and initiative was not returned – again the same no-response to my invites of the original world-wide years – I had hoped there would be some mutual benefit – but almost all promises and agreements were deftly side-swiped – I still wanted to make some contact with some of the old gang –

    I invited idiot friend to visit a women who had been in a wheel chair for a major portion of her recent life (partly due to World-Wide influence not to see the doctor at a critical period; result was that she is in a wheel chair today, recently her left leg was amputated, there is a constant threat of losing her right leg too) anyway, he never came and I ended up doing the visit alone.

    I invited idiot friend to visit Mrs X, mainly because I didn’t want to go alone because she is now married  (to a non-church member) – I still have my somewhat pointless interest in a few people, especially seeing that I got to know them and wondered how their children were – he never came back to me

    His own friend, whose wife had suffered 20 yrs from multiple sclerosis, finally received an agreement that we would visit him on a certain day – after much pushing from my side – I sent the SMS to his friend myself – I ended up on the agreed date visiting his friend on my own – he simply did not arrive

    Even the invite to visit his friend’s wife in the hospital never materialized – I ended up doing the visit with the pastor only

    Idiot friend is now divorced, and everyone feels sorry for him, they refuse to call him on his shit (that would be un-christian!) – when he fails to deliver on a promise, they simply shrug their shoulders and slink off.

    The times that we went to his house after church, on the weekends that it was his turn to spend with his children, you could cut the atmosphere with a knife – half the time his children were in tears, or ready to burst into tears – kind of reminded me of the time we were all in World-Wide – not much has changed, except I guess his wife finally wised up and went for the divorce

    I don’t intend to be unnecessary mean, but this guy has no clue to basic decency, never follows up on promises, loves to make excuses for bad behavior and talks to his children like shit. His place is usually a mess, he never even has a space for guests to sit down. If you are lucky enough to have to get a cup of coffee, it’s a serrated cup – he does not even have the sense to throw his broken cups out and just keep a small set of cups should he have guests – half the time he has no coffee, no tea, no milk, no sugar etc. No spare stuff like coke, water or juice for any potential guests.

    Times that I have been there,  he disappears to his room, without a word. Maybe ten minutes later he shouts “makes us some coffee” – fuck that, I’m not his girlfriend! He expects you to wade through his mess, wash some cups because it’s all piled in the sink, use ESP to figure out where the coffee is etc etc.

    I have to say that many in World-wide (or from) are a walking disaster!!

    Can I exclude myself from that? Obviously, we all suffered financially and career-wise; I’d like to think I’ve learnt a few things, the only thing to do now is actually start reaping something

    Having turned 50 recently, I take stock and wonder; I really only have one long-standing male friend – he is an atheist and has no interest in religion, in fact he recently asked me to explain a few things to him, since his “religious IQ” is so low – I answered him in as factual way as possible. He is now overseas, so really I have no long-standing friends close-by – imagine!

    I wonder about the people that I have known, many of them “religious” ie church-going, and how on earth they reconcile their apathetic approach to the principles of “Christianity” – I wonder how people reconcile their way of life with the theories that they receive in church. Where are the results, where are the impacts? Why are families so dysfunctional?

    When I was still in my early 20’s, I studied the Dale Carnegie principles of human relationships – even though I was strongly influenced by the church, I noticed the complete DISCONNECT between Dale Carnegie and “the only true church”. I have personally done four Carnegie courses, at my own cost, a total of about 40 weeks of training – and read all the books at an early age.

    I mentioned Dale Carnegie a few times in world-wide – I was often met with shock – in some cases an arrogant snigger – “Dale Carnegie??? What a load of rubbish etc etc – the only thing I believe in is the bible etc etc”

    Somehow they missed “Let every man be quick to hear, slow to speak”

    You want to know the ROOT CAUSE of problems in the world?


    John Smith December 2012


    Hi John,

    Sad letter and commentary on people in general.

    In American society, so many people are so self involved that its like they don't even dwell within it. In the cult they told us not to be of the world which is part of society. The church was and is a subculture of the outward society that they condemn. This fostering of anti-social behavior under the guise of religion carries on even when they leave the fold.

    The herd instinct is not only in religion but in the other god. Politics. It is ideology that drives people. Ideology that promises benefits to the one who possesses it. Hence you create followers.  

    You wrote:

    "I wonder about the people that I have known, many of them “religious” ie church-going, and how on earth they reconcile their apathetic approach to the principles of “Christianity” – I wonder how people reconcile their way of life with the theories that they receive in church. Where are the results, where are the impacts? Why are families so dysfunctional?"

    If the truth be told, the church people are just a subculture, a cult if you will, that operates as a private social club for those who meet together. You make the mistake that they give a rats ass about others. They don't. In fact I found a very small percent of us went and visited the elderly, the poor or infirm-ed. It is just too much work to force yourself to participate in others lives that you don't really give a fuck about.

    This is why you are having a problem with these x-wcg'ers and current wcg'ers. You believed in the scriptures, they didn't/don't. You see this by their actions. They empty garbage pails full of the vilest slanders and defamations on the clean garments of honorable people who actually make a difference for good in the world, while they themselves are merchants of sleaze preaching their propaganda of hate.


    Like I said, they are self absorbed. Church goers are no different as to the UN-churched. Except that those who honor God with their lips stand out as religious hypocrites. They say they stand out away and above those outside their cult subculture by the power of the holy spirit. But do they really?

    Considering that these quisquilious demagogues lobotomize everyone caught thinking an independent thought, or pursuing any endeavor they deem fitting to their skills, talent, and interests, I would say the "spirit" they possess is more in line with a Maoist totalitarian death machine. Step out of line and you pay the price! When a member of the collective pronounces their ignorance by saying "the only thing I believe in is the bible" know that this is like what the Maoist would say when they would hold up "the little red book" with rants of condemnation going out towards the world.



     First off I apologize for any illiteracy within my typing it's not intended but I have limited use of my hands and often times mispell words due to that not due to being ignorant. Having said that this is not hate mail either just saying. There are a lot of valid points you made about religion and the fallacies behind it. But in my personal opinion it sounds like your bashing christians which also in my opinion doesn't make your cause any better then theres was when they persecuted witches. You could possible add more facts as towards what it is that you do believe in if not christianity. Yes you have a some things pertaining to the facts behind the works of science but you don't provide much detail as to what it is your faith is in if not christianity then what science? Not that I am saying that science isn't something to rely on because theres more irrefutable (sorry if that's not spelled correctly) facts about science then there is in religion. This has been something I've been struggling with as of lately as to whether to put my faith in science or religion. When science tries to base things on cold hard facts 1+2=3 and whereas religion there is so many different variations and depictions of what God might be ranging from christianity, judaism, muslim, islam, hinduism, and a few others I can't think of off the top of my head right now. But with all of these different possiblities it's really difficult for one to decide what to believe in. I would also have to agree wuth another part of your article if god existed why si there so much injustice in the world? God supposedly sent hellfire upon sodom and gomorrah for their sinful lustful ways. But in todays day and age we've got drugs and prostitution, nuclear warfare and famine. And what god just chooses to sit idley by and do nothing about it? not likely. There are thoughts that those cities were possbily destroyed by some sort of nuclear explosion or battle. Which to me sounds more of a likely possibility then god raing hellfire because they were "sinful in their ways" but due to the fact that people of that day and age were niave to the ways of science and could've possibly have just mistaken it for a religous act. But then again it was sherlock holmes that said when you eliminate theimpossible however improbable must be true. That was just a thought for something you could possibly add to your sit in which I do not mind I found the article to be a good read even though I feel you could add more facts instead of seeming like you were out to bash chriastianity. oh my name is jamarr bowling



    Which article are you speaking about? Can you send me a link?


    Jamarr never wrote back. I was looking forward to a discussion on the subject. 
    I suspect the article he is mentioning above could be found somewhere on this page.


    Jamarr writes back:

    How do you not know which article Iam referring to? I quoted it in the subject. Well here is a link



    You wrote: "How do you not know which article Iam referring to? I quoted it in the subject. Well here is a link"

    Well with close to 2000 pages I can't remember them all! That is why I asked you for a link!

    Now you wrote: "But in my personal opinion it sounds like your bashing  christians"

    Personally I do not believe in bashing Christians. If people want to believe in a God, I say that is their business. To each their own.

    The Painful Truth has articles from many different authors who contributed their own personal opinions and ideology. Some believe in science and others believe in the aspect of various religious teachings.

    The purpose of this site is to educate and to make some semblance of understanding of the experience (as) to the past members or associates of the WCG and the daughter cults. People want to know, and they have a right to understand how they were scammed by these religious charlatans. This is one of the purposes of this website.

    To expose evil so that others might not suffer from such a miscarriage is a noble cause. The contributions from the former membership of the WCG and the daughter cults stands as testimony to others who might be inquiring as to the religious scam known as Armstrongism.



    I would just like to say that I read your article on slave mentality. It was honest and true. I hope lots of people read it and are set free. Knowledge is power and freedom. Amen! Jesus is the true answer. He has come to set the captive free.



    Hi Angie,

    Yes that article is a popular one here on the Painful Truth. When people are ready they will seek the freedom they so richly desire. There is nothing better than breaking free and doing what you want to do, go where you desire and seek out a future without being mind fucked by some low life scum sucking prick who calls himself a minister or deacon of God!
    "Jesus is the true answer. He has come to set the captive free."
    He did indeed come to set people free. Free from the binders of organized religion and oppressive regimes who are nothing less than Phariseeism in nature and who use a strict and hypocritical interpretation of the letter of the law. They are useless.



     Hi Sir, A couple of months ago I met this young lady and we hit it of just right or what it seemed to be right and I know that the bible speaks about not being unequally yoked but at the time I did not really asked to much questions about her religion all I knew is that she went to church on Saturdays and said it was a non-denominational church. She had mention things like people dying and still having a second chance of redemption and repentance but my ears were still closed and I didn't really pick up as to what she was saying. The next conversation was about the meaning of hell she defined it as the grave at this point my thought process kicked in and I needed to find out more about where this ideas were coming from so I decided to go to church with her. From this meeting I picked up a booklet it was their official Statement of Fundamental Beliefs and inside I found out about Mr. Armstrong and a guy named Roderick C. Meredith so i decided to look into Armstrong's past and found out that it was some type of cult. So my question to you sir is where can I find more proof about their belief system and what are there finer points and how to exposed them for who they really are. Right now Sir I don't know who to turn to for advice so please forgive me for emailing you here at this email address I just need to be pointed out into the right direction. Thanks

    Juan R.


     Hi Juan, I will get to the point as to Herbert Armstrong and his daughter cults. Armstrong basically stole his doctrines from the Mormons, Jehovah Witnesses and the 7th day Adventists. You wrote that you would like to expose them for who they are? Just take the time to read the Painful Truth. We have hundreds of pages of testimonial from survivors of Armstrong's cult and daughter cults. The latest articles can be found here:

    A good place to start is here:
    The Ambassador Report documents much of Armstrong's cult history along with Meredith's cult.

    For what its worth, relationships seldom work out when one person has deeply held religious beliefs differing from anothers. You will have to fully embrace this young ladies cult and all the teachings and baggage that goes along with it if you are to even have a chance with her and be accepted. The question you should be asking yourself is, "Do I really want this women so bad that I am ready to sacrifice my personal freedom, my free-will and peace of mind in order to have a relationship with her?"

    As to exposing this group as a cult, this has been done. Meredith knows about this site and the others that expose him and Herbert Armstrong. Now Juan, I must ask, would you want to follow a man that did this to his own child?

    And then there are the murders. Did the lady tell you about them or did she forget?

    Here is a link to a search engine (located on my front page) linking to other sites along with my own that expose the LCG and its leadership. Its really all you need to know in the end.

    You have a lot of homework to do, much to learn and decisions to make.



     Dear James

    Recently, the subject of mother Teresa came up via my only (reluctant) x-world-wide contact - - I was the recipient of a long discussion about faith, and of course “Sam” was an expert. I got the whole thing, about how everyone was WRONG, and how he was right, and how HE had issues in his life, but he just right on keeping on, and this was the perfect example of faith - - he seemed to IGNORE the age old issues he had in his life, such as many family and communication problems, and BOASTED that his faith had overcome all his problems – funny thing, he still didn’t know how to speak decently to his wife and children, who had by now married and had their own children

    His famous discussion is the one about his son who has no interest in god, and is going the wrong way, and how all his SUCCESS in the world is going to mean nothing; he never says a good word about his son, DO YOU GET THE IRONY: God said “this is my Son, in whom I’m well-pleased” But Sam says: “This is my son, in whom I’m disappointed, because he is not flat broke like the rest of world-wide. He goes oversees and plays golf, B-A-A-A-D - - he has a successful career and lots of friends B-A-A-A-D - - - he has a successful marriage and beautiful children B –A-A-D - - - The fact that he has a bad relationship with his son, and that his son no longer comes to his place for dinner etc, seems to indicate only that the problem is with his son.

    Anyway, I was the recipient of a long discourse relating to mother Teresa (MT), where he expounded how FALSE the faith of MT actually was - - Now, this is NOT original, since I remember discussions in world-wide about how MT’s faith would NOT be accepted by God, since she was a daughter of the Babylon Whore, the Catholic church. So, apparently giving up your life for the service of the poor is somehow “not acceptable to God”, even though the bible says “Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world.”

    Sam went to great lengths to explain that MT had great doubts about the presence of God, and had various other problems with her faith. NOW, did the WORLD-WIDE CHURCH not have problems with THEIR faith? They always claimed they KNEW and that THEY KNEW THAT THEY KNEW, and had no doubts. BASED ON THIS LOGIC: If you do not doubt, and yet do NOTHING, don’t help the poor etc, but gather tithes to support and make the church fat, that is OK, BUT if you doubt and nevertheless DO SOMETHING and help the poor, then that is NOT acceptable to God (?????) I cannot help thinking that Sam’s reasoning is completely dishonest, and a self-delusion; the dishonestly is even further illustrated by a rudimentary google search under “mother Teresa”, where the latest articles indicate a few biographies which outline MT’s difficulties with her faith: I believe Sam simply COPIED these reasonings, and pretended to be “up to speed” with the mother Teresa question - - He did the typical world-wide thing: he bombarded me with “proof” that MT had inferior faith, BUT failed to mention his source; a Google search indicates a few authors who outline MT’s problems, ie she doubted at various times in her life, and confessed that she did not really feel the presence of God!!! QUESTION: Who does ??

    Apparently, that’s the whole point of faith anyway, the “evidence of things not seen” I cannot help wondering what exactly Sam’s point is anyway; he seems to have a lot to say about other’s “false faith” – BUT you know what psychologists say; if you constantly verbalize a problem, the problem is YOURS, not other peoples. Sam seems to spend a lot of time trying to convince me of the validity of HIS faith, of how HIS faith overcomes HIS problems, of how other people’s faith is false, or inferior, he talks a lot about how HE controls his mind when confronted by various issues etc etc He likes to talk about how HE understands people, and how people open up to HIM, how people do not lie to HIM, because of HIS understanding etc etc - - my experience is the opposite, I do not open up to him, because I do not trust my personal things with him, I do not open up to him, because he tends to cut you off, interrupt, listen for 2 minutes then talk for 20 minutes, he dismisses any discussions that he has no interest in as “that’s not important” etc etc

    He recently told me about a single woman with a child, who had opened up to HIM, because she trusts HIM, with certain facts of her life. I later met this woman, who told me a few facts about her life that was OPPOSITE to Sam’s version. One day, I mentioned these facts to Sam; again he said it was IMPOSSIBLE because she would not lie to HIM. One day, he made a spur of the moment arrangement with her to meet HIM at his home, when I happened to be there (at Sam’s home). It became late, so I mentioned that she probably changed her mind because of the time of day, and very likely would by that time get a lift from her boyfriend. Sam replied that she would not lie to HIM, and that she had personally told HIM that she did not have a relationship etc etc, and that people trusted HIM, and that therefore she WOULD arrive at his place. Sam refused to believe that she had a boyfriend, even though she had told me that she did. It turned out that she never arrived, because her boyfriend fetched her in his vehicle, and was not interested in going to Sam or having anything to do with Sam.

    You might ask, why would anybody go to so much trouble to convince me of their “superiority” in dealing with other people – usually, if this was the case, the person would not harp on and on about it. My take on the mother Teresa question is that anyone who claims to be religious, better zip their mouths before they criticize someone who dedicates their life to the service of those who are unfortunate. Apparently, mother Teresa was not perfect, had problems with her faith, the movement that she started did not always offer the most appropriate medical attention, the movement reached a point where quantity was chosen over quality, therefore inadequate medical and professional care was given – valid comments, but compare to any religious movement and you will find flaws, even when most live in relative comfort. I find it bizarre that after this time that x-world-widers would criticize mother Teresa – which one of those loud mouths would be prepared to give up everything and actually live amongst the world’s most destitute? Somehow I think their faith lacks the conviction to do that – yet they “believe”

    John Smith


    Hi John,

    The man or women who brags about having an enormous amount of faith also has an enormous amount of doubt. His bragging betrays his inner thoughts on a host of subjects. His cognitive dissonance clouds all his value judgments, and evaluations. His inner thoughts (self-identity) is in conflict with his crazy religion. This is the same as the missionary who knocks on doors endlessly. He performs his duty thinking to himself that he is doing the "Lords Work." But is he really? The reality is, he is simply trying to keep his "faith" strong in order to quiet his inner conflict.

    When I was in Herbie's little cult of horrors I also recall this "problem" with Mother Teresa and her service to humanity. The answer from the pulpit was that God was not calling her at this time. This in itself caused me problems.

    For instance, Mother Teresa was doing a work in service to the poor. That is biblical and is an expression of true undefiled faith. What was the church and all the people doing? Praying for the apocalypse to come upon the world.

    No one ever did a damned thing to make this world just a tad bit better. I saw more love and peace in other groups than I ever saw in the Armstrong religious cult(s). Altruism did not exist in the church or within the hearts of the membership. By all definitions, the church was faithless. It was, and remains to this very day, one of the most piss poor example of Christianity the world has ever seen.

    The concept that we were to become Kings and Priests in the world tomorrow is laughable. Leadership in the cult(s) consists of being like the despicable politicians of this land. They can turn a honest person that once had character and integrity into one who has perfected dishonesty and corruption. They are ruthless, unprincipled, self-seeking, lying, cheating, piece of shit corporate whores that feed off ignorance and fear, fucking the entire system up in order to keep their power over others.

    Did I forget to mention, without compassion for the "little people" under them?

    Your “friend” is someone who has never spent one minute in the real world, cannot verbalize a cognitive analogy to enforce his point of view, and yet thinks that he knows what's best for everyone else. He lives in a intellectual free zone as he pukes forth his worthless opinions. With friends like Sam, you would be better off seeking out your enemies.






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