Comments on Ambassador Watch: Excuse me Ronnie - the Pope's a better prophet than thou

...carried away in cattle cars...100 million? To w...

2008-12-23T16:33:00.000+13:00

...carried away in cattle cars...

100 million? To where? Assyria? To do what? Sit in concentration camps? Slave labor?

Stop by my blogg:theprophetwhofailed.blogspot.com/...

2008-12-23T13:59:00.000+13:00

Stop by my blogg:

theprophetwhofailed.blogspot.com/

All are welcome!

Dill Weed

Anonymous said... Anon 2:01 -I think soldier vs so...

2008-12-23T02:10:00.000+13:00

Anonymous said...

Anon 2:01 -

I think soldier vs soldier who put their country first is a little different from nuking civilan targets. Will killing other Catholics be intentional, or collateral damage?

And would you like to comment on the marching off of captives issue?

Anonymous,

Yes, there is just a "little" difference. As for "intentional or collateral damage," it won't matter. They will be just as dead either way. Maybe the European ones won't consider the American ones to be "good" Catholics.

As for the "marching off of csptives" issue, maybe they won't march. Maybe they'll be carried away in cattle cars, like in the bad old days.

Anon 2:01 -I think soldier vs soldier who put thei...

2008-12-23T00:26:00.000+13:00

Anon 2:01 -

I think soldier vs soldier who put their country first is a little different from nuking civilan targets. Will killing other Catholics be intentional, or collateral damage?

And would you like to comment on the marching off of captives issue?

Anonymous said... ...German nightmare...really mig...

2008-12-22T14:01:00.000+13:00

Anonymous said...

...German nightmare...really might be coming...

And the Catholic superpower is going to nuke, despite the 50 million Catholics in the USA?

Just wondering. Oh, Canada... we mustn't forget Canada...

Anonymous,

That's right! German Catholics faught American Catholics in World War I, and again in World War II, and they'll try it again in World War III. Nothing new there.

You are also right about Canada! You can be sure that their behavior is being carefully noted too and that they will not be forgotten or left out of the fight or left behind during the exile.

Bamboo_bends said... There's wisdom, there's opini...

2008-12-22T13:52:00.000+13:00

Bamboo_bends said...

There's wisdom, there's opinion, there's insights, and there's just plain wrong things and ideas from centuries ago, that we don't do in a civilized society.

Oh, lets kick out all the Gay Christian Harry Potter fans now before its too late for our nation and we are attacked from Europe!

Wait...didn't Harry Potter come to us from Europe?

Incurably Bent Bamboo,

Nope! He came to us from a wicked divorced woman from Britain (Ephraim). Looks like they might get nuked too for behaving like that.

You see, "there's just plain wrong things and ideas from centuries ago" that are still being done to this very day in our supposedly "civilized society."

Gavin said... Alas, concepts of irony and sarcasm ...

2008-12-22T13:42:00.000+13:00

Gavin said...

Alas, concepts of irony and sarcasm seem lost on some folk...

Yeah! That Paul Ray guy really needs to lighten up a bit.

Well, shreds of evidence - or even better - DO exi...

2008-12-22T11:42:00.000+13:00

Well, shreds of evidence - or even better - DO exist that Mark wrote first. "Markan priority" is based on some pretty convincing textual evidence.

Well, since there's not a single ancient text that mentions Mark being written first, there can't be any convincing textual evidence. All we have are speculations and analysis of the extant texts of the Gospel of St. Mark. It's scholarly guesswork. There is simply no way to tell, based simply on the data provided by the Gospel texts themselves, which of them were written in what order.

Convincing enough to persuade the vast majority of scholars - Catholic and Protestant, evangelical and liberal.

Truth is not determined by a majority vote. The mere fact that they were persuaded doesn't mean the hypothesis is correct -- it's the argument and evidence brought forward that matters . . . and when it comes to Markan priority, as it with all the various speculations about how the four Gospels came to be written, there just isn't any evidence that we can work with . . . except the testimony of the early Christians, that is, who notably disbelieved in Markan priority. Of course they could have been wrong, but you'd think that a religion that, in just 30 or 40 years (or less) after the Synoptics were written, had made those four writings the centerpiece of their sacred writings would have some trace of memory that the shortest Gospel was the first to be written.

The Spokesman Witness had a few things to say abou...

2008-12-22T09:47:00.000+13:00

The Spokesman Witness had a few things to say about the pope and his prophecies in yesterday's sermon.

He also had a few things to say about his mockers. Gavin, you and I won't be blogging much longer as we're to die speedily from the inside. And since he truly really, really for sure has his Witness powers this time we're goners.

Paul Ray --That's why the OT prophets write so muc...

2008-12-22T01:11:00.000+13:00

Paul Ray --

That's why the OT prophets write so much about those four things...

Of course, you need to "here a little,..." to find Harry Potter. But, if you put together references to Esau (a Hairy man) and Judas Iscariot (the Potter's field), it's a start...

Things God hates most:1) Two women getting married...

2008-12-21T06:54:00.000+13:00

Things God hates most:

1) Two women getting married.
2) Harry Potter
3) Abortions
4) Worshiping him on Sundays.

What an eclectic list. Your psycho God sounds a bit unfocused.

Paul Ray

Where is the Pope even directly mentioned in the B...

2008-12-21T04:14:00.000+13:00

Where is the Pope even directly mentioned in the Bible? More speculative HWAcaca!

Remember when WCG embarrassed itself fawning all over Franz Josef Strauss as he visited the AC 'dena campus?

BB

Is it a package deal with the COGs? I mean, do you...

2008-12-21T03:53:00.000+13:00

Is it a package deal with the COGs? I mean, do you have to believe their OC teachings as well as their proprietary interpretation of the book of Revelation? It seems that the different flavors of COGdom have their own spin on the book and make their distinctives out of that. Of course they have to all be different, that's what will enforce the exaltation of their leaders! Can't people see that this has less to do with any biblical interpretation and more to do with the leaders of these various churches being UNABLE to submit to anyone else's authority? They want to be the chief priest, and if they can't be then they will create their own kingdom where they can. HWA taught them well about all the trappings of authority, power, and wealth. Their motto? "Why wait for the kingdom, live like a king now."

Anonymous said... But don't ever think that the po...

2008-12-20T17:28:00.000+13:00

Anonymous said...
But don't ever think that the pope is a true prophet. Revelation 19:20 calls him a "false prophet."

Yep, sure does. "The Pope is the false prophet" (Rev. 19:20).

Don't look that up, just take my word for it.

Anonymous wrote: The Bible says what it says. You ...

2008-12-20T16:55:00.000+13:00

Anonymous wrote: The Bible says what it says. You have to accept it without accepting all the ADDITIONAL ERROR that people make up.

This kind of thinking reveals a Biblicist right off the starting mark. That and the term "Living Word of God", which is blasphemy on its face, for theirs nothing living about the Bible. Life is a property of living beings...

There's wisdom, there's opinion, there's insights, and there's just plain wrong things and ideas from centuries ago, that we don't do in a civilized society.

As for the German nightmare, well, it really might be coming yet to some nations near you that have rejected God's ways and gotten into many very evil practices, such as same-sex marriages, Harry Potter wizardry, abortion, Sunday-keeping, etc.

Oh, lets kick out all the Gay Christian Harry Potter fans now before its too late for our nation and we are attacked from Europe!
Wait...didn't Harry Potter come to us from Europe?

...German nightmare...really might be coming...If ...

2008-12-20T15:39:00.000+13:00

...German nightmare...really might be coming...

If I remember correctly, we were told the 1/3 of the US who survive the attacks will be "taken into captivity." With current figures, about 100 Million. Do COGs still have the hardline view that we'll be marched off to Germany, as Israel and Judah were in the Assyrian and Babylonian captivities?

And the Catholic superpower is going to nuke, despite the 50 million Catholics in the USA?

Just wondering. Oh, Canada... we mustn't forget Canada...

Byker Bob said... To Anonymous 2:34 PM: My parent...

2008-12-20T12:45:00.000+13:00

Byker Bob said...

To Anonymous 2:34 PM: My parents bought into the criteria you just described way back in the 1950s. Sadly, they had no firm rooting, or understanding of the epistle to the Galatians, or they would have realized that such criteria were totally bogus. But, they didn't, and fell head over heels into HWA's scam. My entire childhood was ruined by HWA's fantasy that the Germans were going to come and get us by 1972. Because I thought at the time that HWA was actually acting on behalf of God, I made some detrimental choices which I most certainly would not have made had I known that he was just another one of those Deut.18:22 dudes.

Byker Bob,

Sorry to hear about your German nightmares. The problem is that HWA was just guessing about 1972. God had not revealed any such thing to HWA. When HWA wrote the 1975 in Prophecy! booklet of guesses in the late 1950's he still had not learned anything from his previous mistake of thinking that Hitler and the short Italian guy would win World War II.

At the same time, please consider the situation of the 2 billion Sunday-keeping Catholics and Protestants today. Some of them, at least for a while, take some of their church teachings seriously. This makes them sincere, but sincerely WRONG. Imagine the fear of those who truly believe that if they are lost they will be tormented forever in an ever-burning-but-never-quite-consuming hell fire. The Catholics also have to worry that even if they do eventually make it, they might first have to spend some time in Purgatory (a word not in the Bible).

Many Catholics have been abused by Catholic priests thanks to the RC church's "doctrine of demons" that forbids them to marry. The point is that rejecting God's Sabbaths to observe things like Sunday and Christmas is not all wonderful pretty colored lights and gifts.

The Bible says what it says. You have to accept it without accepting all the ADDITIONAL ERROR that people make up.

As for the German nightmare, well, it really might be coming yet to some nations near you that have rejected God's ways and gotten into many very evil practices, such as same-sex marriages, Harry Potter wizardry, abortion, Sunday-keeping, etc.

As for the pope being a better prophet than Ronald Weinland, that would not take much. Also, the pope knows what he is doing behind the scenes, so he can "predict" with that knowledge. But don't ever think that the pope is a true prophet. Revelation 19:20 calls him a "false prophet."

"Well, shreds of evidence - or even better - DO ex...

2008-12-20T09:55:00.000+13:00

"Well, shreds of evidence - or even better - DO exist that Mark wrote first. "Markan priority" is based on some pretty convincing textual evidence.

Thank you Gavin.

Markan priority, to me, in my opinion, as far as I can tell, it seems to me, (how'm I doin'?), is a pretty up to date and convincing piece of work.

Should I even dare suggest that the 21st chapter of John, which Gospel has two endings, is the missing ending of Mark at 16:8, which has no good ending?

Nah...won't bring it up
:)

Well, shreds of evidence - or even better - DO exi...

2008-12-20T07:33:00.000+13:00

Well, shreds of evidence - or even better - DO exist that Mark wrote first. "Markan priority" is based on some pretty convincing textual evidence. Convincing enough to persuade the vast majority of scholars - Catholic and Protestant, evangelical and liberal. Even Mark Goodacre, who opposes the Q hypothesis, maintains Markan priority.

For a 90 second intro to the subject that explains it in a truly unique way - no degree required - click

Jordanes, I've not spoken to Anthony Buzzard or Ke...

2008-12-20T07:15:00.000+13:00

Jordanes, I've not spoken to Anthony Buzzard or Ken Westby since the early 60s, and I've never studied their lit. But neither of them is stupid, not by a long shot.

Nobody said they’re stupid. They’re both very intelligent. They’re also wrong.

If Christians hadn't been so committed to the notion that messiahs are gods, Jews might have been more willing to look at Jesus over the past 1900 years.

Or more likely, based on what the historical records tell us, Jesus Himself was committed to the notion that He was the Messiah and was both God and man, thus offending those Jews who couldn’t accept that God could assume a human nature.

Jesus' contemporaries were quite enamoured with him when he rode into Jerusalem on a donkey's colt. But as Jews they had no illusions that he was God.

Yep. And that’s how He ended up dead just five days later. Given a chance to say whether or not He was the Messiah, He not only affirmed that He was but went further and insisted that the Messiah is divine, equal to God, seated at God’s right hand and riding the clouds of heaven, as the Old Testament depicts Yhvh.

As for "I and my father are one," Jesus also prayed "that they all may be one," referring to all his followers. Are all of Jesus' followers God? They all created the universe?

Context, Anonymous. Context. (Hint: look up the words “theosis” and “divinization.”)

He also insisted that the opening statement of the Sh'ma is the most important statement in the Hebrew Scriptures, "Listen, Israel, the LORD our God (singular), the LORD is One." Christians say that refers to a Duality or Trinity,

No, Christians say that refers to a Trinity.

and ignore the oft-repeated opinion of God Himself, that "I alone am God and there is no one else."

If the one God is a Trinity of Persons, there’s no contradiction in God saying that He alone is God and there is no other.

At least we have an admission that the Pope does h...

2008-12-20T07:00:00.000+13:00

At least we have an admission that the Pope does have his own Midrash as did the Evangelists.

Not much of an “admission.” As the Popes have been saying for 2,000 years, everybody interprets the Bible. It’s not like a book can interpret itself. The question is which interpretations are right and which are wrong, not whether or not people interpret the Bible.

I think we can also note that Mark preferred his own Midrash to Matthews and Matthew preferred his own to Luke and John, well, John was John.

I doubt we have enough information to be able to conclude that St. Mark “preferred” his take on Jesus to those of the other Evangelists. All we can say is that he had a take on Jesus that differed from those of the other three Evangelists.

You'd think that if the Gospels were eyewitness accounts, Mark, being first, would have at least had an actual resurrection account of Jesus and not just ending with frightened women running from the tomb telling no one anything.

Of course there’s not a shred of evidence that St. Mark wrote first. The earliest tradition is unanimous that St. Matthew wrote first, and there is no rival tradition that places St. Mark first. That’s only a hypothesis.

As for the shorter version of St. Mark’s Gospel, it is no less lacking a “resurrection account of Jesus” than the other Gospels are: none of them relate the event of the resurrection. They only mention how the tomb was found empty Sunday morning and then people saw Him alive.

We'd also not expect that 'Matthew' would copy nearly 90% of Mark for his own "eyewitness account," nor Luke over 54% of Mark for his.

Of course we don’t know that St. Matthew copied St. Mark. For all we know it was the other way around.

There are no actual records of Thallus or Phlegon mentioning this.

Not any more, that is. All we have now are quotes and cites from later writers. That is true of most ancient writers.

Only a claim by Africanus, a Christian writer, that they wrote this. Phlegon would not even have been a contemporary of the event (he wrote in about 140 AD).

Thallus was contemporary, however, and Phlegon wasn’t too much later than Tacitus and Josephus, whose historical writings from circa A.D. 100 and later are accepted as solid sources of history going back well prior to the time they wrote.

However, we do have actual records from other writers like Seneca the Younger and Pliny the Elder. They discussed natural disasters like earthquakes, volcanoes, floods, eclipses, and comets in their books, but neither one of them mentioned a three-hour period of darkness at midday. They referred to events far less phenomenal but didn't mention three hours of darkness at midday.

Three hours of darkness is more phenomenal than earthquakes and volcanoes?

Anyway, you’re only offering an argument from silence, and absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. Just because the extant writings of Seneca and Pliny don’t mention the three hours of darkness and the earthquake in Jerusalem doesn’t mean they didn’t mention them in other writings since lost – and even if they didn’t mention them at all, that doesn’t mean they didn’t happen. Are there any reasons to doubt that Thallus and Phlegon wrote what Africanus and later writers say they wrote?

"If anyone claiming to be a prophet does not obser...

2008-12-20T06:25:00.000+13:00

"If anyone claiming to be a prophet does not observe God's weekly Sabbath, that person is a false prophet and not a true Christian."

I agree with this. The reason I do is because prophets and sabbath keeping are not needed after Christ. So, if you claim to be a prophet, then you are still O.C., under the law, and must keep the sabbath. Prophets pointed us to Christ, and so did the sabbath rest. And now we have Jesus. Amen.

Twas noted:"Perhaps Jesus wanted a flexible oral t...

2008-12-20T01:13:00.000+13:00

Twas noted:

"Perhaps Jesus wanted a flexible oral tradition rather than fixed wording produced by great effort by humorless scribes?"

Sounds more then like Jesus could not write personally. I doubt a literate, well gifted writer would opt for oral traditions of his words which he labeled "life" itself.

Sitting around the campfire telling stories of Jesus for a few decades is risky business when it comes to getting it straight since the penalty for not getting it straight is the Lake of Fire, Eternal Hell or whatever. Not a very well thought out program by the Deity if that's how it gets sent out.

On the other hand there is a school of thought that has Jesus, as a pharisee himself going against, the grain.

Or an Essene cutting loose..

Or a goofball...

Or one who never in his wildest dreams every thought of starting a church since that all was added after his unexpected death..

or a nice guy named Brian who was misunderstood...

The sheer amount of confusion over Jesus, his reality, his origins, his message, his meaning, his intent and the length of his hair is enough to tell us something is terribly wrong with what is supposed to be THE most important topic on God's mind for all humanity.

Perhaps the scripture should have read.."Behold, I will build my church and it will be all downhill from there..."

Happy Holiday to all and to those who don't care...enjoy the Solstice because it the birth of the SUN, yet again, no matter.
:)

“Would God commit his Word to numbskulls?”The cent...

2008-12-19T21:25:00.000+13:00

“Would God commit his Word to numbskulls?”
The central idea of Christianity is to expand the franchise of God’s people, by simplifying the membership requirements. Jesus highlights what he feels are the key points, making membership in salvation a matter of Grace with a directive for behavior. His constant pardoning of sinners and other acts make it clear that “perfection” or “identity” are in no ways keys to the kingdom.

“The biblical seventh-day Sabbath IS a SIGN that helps to identify God's people.”
Wrong. It identifies you as a Jew, which has been made obsolete, for a Christian, as a key to salvation. I might agree with you on the SDA keeping pictures of a long haired man in their temples as being an example of graven images, which still might seem not kosher. But then again, the whole kosher and perfect thing was thrown out the window by Christ, the founder of the religion.

Eat your ham in peace.

To Anonymous 2:34 PM: My parents bought into the ...

2008-12-19T19:59:00.000+13:00

To Anonymous 2:34 PM: My parents bought into the criteria you just described way back in the 1950s. Sadly, they had no firm rooting, or understanding of the epistle to the Galatians, or they would have realized that such criteria were totally bogus. But, they didn't, and fell head over heels into HWA's scam. My entire childhood was ruined by HWA's fantasy that the Germans were going to come and get us by 1972. Because I thought at the time that HWA was actually acting on behalf of God, I made some detrimental choices which I most certainly would not have made had I known that he was just another one of those Deut.18:22 dudes. In retrospect, I would sincerely prefer that my parents had simply lied to me about Santa Clause. It would have been much less damaging than HWA's soul raping lies.

Having suvived numerous decades since then, I've had the satisfaction of watching God divide and confuse the tongue of the Armstrong movement. Clearly, not one of the splinters are doing God's work, or they would not have been allowed to be so consistently wrong. They are a disgraceful joke, calling one another "Laodecean", and stealing members back and forth. I personally believe that God did a tower of Babel number on them because they were not preaching the gospel which He intended, the one which concerns salvation and transformation of our hearts through Jesus. Instead, they have been preaching the gospel of Armageddon, and using this to manipulate and scare people about things of which they remain clueless. They have condoned exhibiting horrible calloused, elitist, non-caring fruits towards all people who are not part of the sanctioned groups.

Believe me, your sabbaths and holydays, tithing and clean meats do not provide any special insights into prophecy. That is a fallacy. We have decades of false alarms, gun laps, and wolf crying to prove this.

There are many different solutions to the Armstrong problem, and some of the most popular ones are represented here and on some of the other blogs. I've tried out a few, and certainly have my own preference these days. But, you may want to check some of them out before wasting more valuable years of your life. Based on my own personal experiences, I would suggest that twenty or thirty years from now, your children will probably appreciate it if you do.

BB