Comments on Ambassador Watch: King James triumphant

Yeah Paul,Seems a shame, doesn't it, when adult me...

2007-09-16T14:02:00.000+12:00

Yeah Paul,

Seems a shame, doesn't it, when adult men and women will call demonstrable truth blasphemy and will hang onto myths that are thousands of years old?

Oh well, we couldn't even make them believe the world was round until Magellan sailed around it in order to prove it.

They have always had to be dragged, kicking and screaming all the way. into acceptance of truth. Whether that truth was the earth orbiting the sun, the existence of germs, the existence of atoms - whatever! They are just a millstone on the neck of normal, intelligent people.

Okay, I admit it guys. You got me. Atheism is noth...

2007-09-16T13:01:00.000+12:00

Okay, I admit it guys. You got me. Atheism is nothing more than another religion. All humans cannot exist on their own without a religion; they all have to believe in something. It's axiomatic. Atheism is just a security blanket that I am using right now; I'll probably dabble in some other pseudo-religion as my tastes change. I apologize for trying to pretend to be rational; I'm not. Atheism also looked like the cool thing to do, and I really want to be thought of as smart and hip.

Sincerely,
Paul

"But I have changed belief systems."Paul: But isn'...

2007-09-16T12:22:00.000+12:00

"But I have changed belief systems."

Paul:

But isn't the above in fact what you really meant?

You exchanged a belief in God to a 100% surefire belief in "there is no God". You converted to belief in atheism as the ultimate belief. Your confident, zealously held personal belief now is - "there is no God" - which is the first commandment of atheism.

"But I have changed belief systems."I meant, "have...

2007-09-16T11:35:00.000+12:00

"But I have changed belief systems."

I meant, "have not," in the sense that I am changing one belief system for another.

Paul

"Problem is that people are always a bit suspiciou...

2007-09-16T11:33:00.000+12:00

"Problem is that people are always a bit suspicious of those that make such radical changes in their belief system."

I understand what you are saying, and if I had "converted" to another "belief system," such as Islam or Wiccan or even New Age mush, then you would have a valid point. But I have changed belief systems. Atheism is not a belief system or religion just as disbelieving in leprechauns is not a rligion or belief system. I am the same person as I was, with only one difference...I no longer believe that gods exist. This is shedding of a perception or belief, not picking up a new one. And I have done so by reason, critical thinking, and observation. It is no different than coming to the conclusion that global warming is/isn't real after all after a lengthy review of the data.

Paul

Hey Paul...I'm not saying you shouldn't be here, I...

2007-09-16T10:44:00.000+12:00

Hey Paul...

I'm not saying you shouldn't be here, I'm just saying your atheism isn't as convincing as you may think. I'd say the same for the suddenly MIA Dennis Diehl, who would find a way to turn a response on any topic into an *long* essay against the Bible, religion, or whatever suited his fancy.

Problem is that people are always a bit suspicious of those that make such radical changes in their belief system. Pick just about any politician you like and you'll find changes in position that most people wouldn't do - yet they espouse to get votes. Did they really believe what they said they did back when? Or do they really believe what they say they do now? In your case, it doesn't help me believe you truly are an atheist if you hang out in a theology student's blog site. It makes me wonder if you're really her to be convinced against what you currently believe - or perhaps you're just a mean and nasty sob that likes to be aggravating and annoying.

I do, however, believe that you gained your current beliefs by critical thinking. I saw an example of that with a man named Herbert Armstrong.

Nothing wrong with critical thinking - it's just not enough.

VonHowitzer

"I will, unashamedly. I'll teach my children, as w...

2007-09-16T08:29:00.000+12:00

"I will, unashamedly. I'll teach my children, as we sit around the pagan tree, with ham sandwiches, the ancient pagan susperstitious origins of the holiday, and how it was recently incorporated into another superstitious religion."

That is what makes this country GREAT! Our diversity and acceptance of others choices.

Lot's of folks keep Christmas as a purely secular holiday. It is a very lovely holiday.

((Well, this is interesting. A topic on Bible tran...

2007-09-16T07:02:00.000+12:00

((Well, this is interesting. A topic on Bible translations turns into a scrum on atheism. Isn't there any else that finds it ironic that former COGers that claim to be atheists hang out in a religion oriented blog? Just how committed to atheism are these people?

BTW, I prefer the NIV, just to keep in topic.

VonHowitzer))

Very good one KMS!!! I had to have a good laugh. The reason why these people are here is, they too are on a mission. A mission to get people more into doubt as opposed to faith.

Yes, to try to stay on topic, I also like the NIV translation (it is one of the most easy to read and less awkward translations written).

"Enjoy :)"I will, unashamedly. I'll teach my child...

2007-09-16T05:47:00.000+12:00

"Enjoy :)"

I will, unashamedly. I'll teach my children, as we sit around the pagan tree, with ham sandwiches, the ancient pagan susperstitious origins of the holiday, and how it was recently incorporated into another superstitious religion.

Paul

"I know I am....bought decorations last night. I a...

2007-09-16T05:37:00.000+12:00

"I know I am....bought decorations last night. I am going to celebrate Christmas/Saturnalia/Yule this year for the first time, and my family and I are going to have a damn good time. I'll think of all of God's True People, in their homes, alternatively trying to ignore or grumbling about Christmas. And I'll get a warm feeling from it, too."

Good for you! You are unashamedly celebrating a pagan custom that has been brought into "The Christian Myth". Better that then stealing from you neighbor.

Enjoy :)

The discussion of which Bible is best is so very a...

2007-09-16T03:47:00.000+12:00

The discussion of which Bible is best is so very appropriate to the Armstrongists' penchant for pick and choose, mix and match religion. It's a mish mash of mismatched doctrines.

Do tithe. It doesn't matter that the Temple System doesn't exist any more. Let the xCoG ministry steal from the Levitical priesthood merely because it doesn't exist any more and the money absolutely must go somewhere! I mean that's logical. A physical nation, one nation under God, a true theocracy [or one that pretends to be], can demand tithes and offerings dependent upon the increase of produce because God gave the Israelites the land as an inheritance [never minding that they drove out the inhabitants all by themselves... mostly]. Because God gave the land, the people had to give back 10% of anything more they grew than what was just a financial wash.

Enter the New Covenant, the Sacrifice of Christ and the destruction of the Temple [exactly 40 years after Jesus died, if you know how to count the calendar dates]. Gone. All gone. The Temple System was no more. Even the Jewish Rabbis know this. But not the pick and choose, mix and match Armstrongists. Oh, no! You must tithe, and not just tithe, but tithe on wages. That was never part of the deal, but it suited Herbert Armstrong just fine as he had his cup of coffee and donut on the Day of Atonement to keep up his strength while the widow ladies faithfully afflicted their souls. It was just another sacrifice to be made for the Church Corporate, that soulless despotic psychopath it / thing to be worshiped in idolatry for the benefit of the blasphemies of an heretic, now dead false prophet.

And according to the prophecies of Scripture, the blood money was taken as an inheritance by the ungodly through the sale of the House for God in Pasadena and the other accumulated paraphernalia of a profligate old coot who lusted after the silver, gold, crystal and other ostentatious riches a dumbed down congregation could provide him.

And so it is, in this mix and match, pick and choose religion, that mish mash of the cafeteria style Old Covenant in New Covenant disguise, that only a small part of the whole law and the curse thereof is kept. It may well be that 40% is overly generous, everything considered.

As for the Feast running from Xmas to New Years, i...

2007-09-16T03:28:00.000+12:00

As for the Feast running from Xmas to New Years, it is time for our traditional Festival Songs:

On the Fifth Day of the Feast,
My True Love gave to me,
Five casual shirts,
Four tube socks,
Three pairs of shoes,
Two piece suit,
'Cause we couldn't afford them the rest of the year!

http://www.whydoesgodhateamputees.com/video7.htmEx...

2007-09-16T03:22:00.000+12:00

http://www.whydoesgodhateamputees.com/video7.htm

Excellent video dealing with Mormons...and Muslims...and Christians.

Paul

"We can continue the time honored traditions cente...

2007-09-16T03:17:00.000+12:00

"We can continue the time honored traditions centered around trees and eggs and other such lovely things."

I know I am....bought decorations last night. I am going to celebrate Christmas/Saturnalia/Yule this year for the first time, and my family and I are going to have a damn good time. I'll think of all of God's True People, in their homes, alternatively trying to ignore or grumbling about Christmas. And I'll get a warm feeling from it, too.

I need to order a big tree this week. As far as decorations go, I believe there are instructions in Jeremiah 10.

Paul

When you get right down to it, you gotta choose th...

2007-09-16T03:14:00.001+12:00

When you get right down to it, you gotta choose the KJV.

I mean, that's what the fundies use and it's never gone out of print in 400 years of abuse.

Where would the Mormons be without it? Even the BoM is in the King's English. One would think that the angel Moroni would have at least known the American English of the 1800s and we know Joe Smith did. So, how fake can one get?

Dost not thou knowest thine ass from thy camel?

"It's the same old pick & choose, part-time law ke...

2007-09-16T03:14:00.000+12:00

"It's the same old pick & choose, part-time law keeping I've been writing about for years."

Absolutely. The Law Lite. The Law- Now With 40% Less Commands.

If you believe that the Bible is the Word of God, and believe that you are to live by it, then you must deal with the description of the Law found in scripture:

The Law is a single entity. It is not divided up into parts, with some parts no longer in effect, while some remain.

There is no "spirit of the law" versus the "letter of the law." There is only the Law.

If you are to observe the Law, you are to observe all of it. Not part of it, or what you deem is reasonable to observe.

Of course, I always get the incredibly ironic response- "you are taking the Law too literally and do not understand the intent/spirit behind it."

Paul

Douglas said:This means that if time goes on, and ...

2007-09-16T02:57:00.000+12:00

Douglas said:

This means that if time goes on, and it will, that the Fall Festival will be held from December 25th through January 1st.

Yes, thank you for reminding me of that. The Jewish calendar is slowly drifting out of date, just as the Julian one was, before the Catholic Church decided to put new rules in place in 1582. I wrote a somewhat lengthy article about this, which can be found at:

www.hwarmstrong.com/calendar-jewish-calculations.htm

I've been a student of different calendars for a long time. It's a fascinating topic, me thinks.

And the whole point of the matter is that the Jews haven't kept their festivals on the correct date in a long, long time. Not most of them anyway. And since Armstrong was a closet Sadducee in this matter, neither did the WCG, and neither do most of his offshoot cults.

But I don't suppose this really bothers most of the Armstrongologists out there any more than it does about employing their servants on the Sabbath. Or make believing that Motel 6 really is a booth. Or the dozens of other ways they shade the meaning of the Law to their convenience and advantage.

It's the same old pick & choose, part-time law keeping I've been writing about for years. They may as well go ahead and drink the orange juice, just like the Herbster was reported to have done, on their Day of Atonement for all the difference it makes.

At any rate, the Jews have had not a few hearty laughs as they watch these goims pretending they are also Jews, complete with their fake yarmulkes and matzo balls on their also misplaced "Night to be much observed" (the actual Jewish Passover). It really is a sight to behold -- these fake Jews trying to out Jewish the Jews! And they will be at it once again in just a few days as they march off to the Feast of Booze, and to the spot where whatever cult guru they are following tells them that "God" has placed his name -- for this year anway. :-)

"Isn't there any else that finds it ironic that fo...

2007-09-16T01:57:00.000+12:00

"Isn't there any else that finds it ironic that former COGers that claim to be atheists hang out in a religion oriented blog?"

Oh, that's me favorite! Or, "What are you doing here (on a Sabbath keeping forum)", or "what do you want," or, "You don't believe in what Mr Armstrong taught so why are you even here?!!?!"

A couple of years ago two men on an Armstrongite forum kept spouting the most ridiculous nonsense...about how the Bible equates the Ten Commandments with the Old Covenant, and what the requirements of the Law were, and such. Most of my journey out of Armstrong Cult-ism is due to critical thinking...an assesment of what I thought at the time was fact (Bible) compared to what I had been taught...but I cannont dicount the part those two men played in helping me get on the road.

Paul

All these different translations of the Bible, lik...

2007-09-15T17:16:00.000+12:00

All these different translations of the Bible, like the KJV, NEB, NIV, but where is the BIB? [The British Israelism Bible]

"The Armstrongists have decided that the Jews have...

2007-09-15T17:06:00.000+12:00

"The Armstrongists have decided that the Jews have the authority, so they will have to keep it even though it seems a bit awkward at times."

So then... let's all buy into the "myths" and let's let all the pastors tell us what to do. We can be jolly and loyal right wing conservative Christians.

We can all join hands and say "yes sir, no sir, three bags full sir" and each week dutifully observe the "day of the Sun".

We can continue the time honored traditions centered around trees and eggs and other such lovely things.

Yes, by all means, let them tell us what to do so that we can dutifully observe all the "myths".

Right...

Stinger,One of the wonders of the way Feasts are c...

2007-09-15T16:17:00.000+12:00

Stinger,

One of the wonders of the way Feasts are calculated by most of the Armstrongists [actually by the Jews who know they are wrong] is that the original calculations were off by just about a quarter hour per year. This means that every 216 years plus or minus a bit, the calculated day of the Spring Equinox is a day later. This year, the Jews figured that the Spring Equinox was April 6/7.

This has all sorts of interesting implications: As time goes on, the Fall Festival falls later and later in the year. In 2,160 years, it will be 10 days later. In 21,600 years it will be 100 days later.

This means that if time goes on, and it will, that the Fall Festival will be held from December 25th through January 1st.

This will be so very convenient for Armstrongists because they can keep the Feast and no one will think anything of it. Feast gifts for the kids will look like Christmas Presents. And as for the Last Great Day, it will give new meaning to "the Feast of Booze" as everyone else begins the New Year that day. Children will not have to beg to get out of school.

Of course, it can't last. Eventually, the Fall Festival will be in the Spring, except of course, south of the equator where it will be kept in the Fall season.

Eventually, we will come full circle and the Feast of Tabernacles will be in the Fall again, but that will be a few years off from now.

The Armstrongists have decided that the Jews have the authority, so they will have to keep it even though it seems a bit awkward at times.

Well, this is interesting. A topic on Bible trans...

2007-09-15T16:10:00.000+12:00

Well, this is interesting. A topic on Bible translations turns into a scrum on atheism. Isn't there any else that finds it ironic that former COGers that claim to be atheists hang out in a religion oriented blog? Just how committed to atheism are these people?

BTW, I prefer the NIV, just to keep in topic.

VonHowitzer

Xenu never existed. sigh I guess I am axenuist n...

2007-09-15T16:07:00.000+12:00

Xenu never existed. *sigh* I guess I am axenuist now. *sob* I believe in nothing! *sob*

(Hangs self in the closet)

Paul, what are your feelings concerning Xenu?

2007-09-15T16:04:00.000+12:00

Paul, what are your feelings concerning Xenu?

The recurring theme here is that atheists, becuase...

2007-09-15T14:20:00.000+12:00

The recurring theme here is that atheists, becuase they do not believe in Jehovah, believe in "nothing." The implication is that this "nothing" entails no morals, no ideals, no perceptions, no observations, no thoughts, no comtemplation, ect. Nothing.

I would like someone to explain this for me. How exactly does this work? I mean, would the same label be made if I state that I do not believe in Zeus?

Paul

Comments on Ambassador Watch: King James triumphant

Yeah Paul,Seems a shame, doesn't it, when adult me...

Okay, I admit it guys. You got me. Atheism is noth...

"But I have changed belief systems."Paul: But isn'...

"But I have changed belief systems."I meant, "have...

"Problem is that people are always a bit suspiciou...

Hey Paul...I'm not saying you shouldn't be here, I...

"I will, unashamedly. I'll teach my children, as w...

((Well, this is interesting. A topic on Bible tran...

"Enjoy :)"I will, unashamedly. I'll teach my child...

"I know I am....bought decorations last night. I a...

The discussion of which Bible is best is so very a...

As for the Feast running from Xmas to New Years, i...

http://www.whydoesgodhateamputees.com/video7.htmEx...

"We can continue the time honored traditions cente...

When you get right down to it, you gotta choose th...

"It's the same old pick & choose, part-time law ke...

Douglas said:This means that if time goes on, and ...

"Isn't there any else that finds it ironic that fo...

All these different translations of the Bible, lik...

"The Armstrongists have decided that the Jews have...

Stinger,One of the wonders of the way Feasts are c...

Well, this is interesting. A topic on Bible trans...

Xenu never existed. *sigh* I guess I am axenuist n...

Paul, what are your feelings concerning Xenu?

The recurring theme here is that atheists, becuase...

Xenu never existed. sigh I guess I am axenuist n...